Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

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The Hoover Platinum Collection according to ASTM608 carpet testing includes the best cleaning bagged upright and best cleaning cyclonic bagless upright on the market today!


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*Baggless Upright : Removes more dirt than any other bagless vacuum on the market using multi-stage cyclonic filtration system and Hoover’s patented WindTunnel™ technology which utilizes three suction tunnels to lift and remove even the hidden dirt (Per ASTM F608)

*New Carpet Cleaner Removes more dirt from carpet than any other leading brand of carpet cleaner (test FCTP-0024)

*Best in class 6 yr warranty!

CarmineD wrote:
Hi Carmine,

What exactly do you admire about the “time tested” underachievers (the *NIH loving suits)?  What techniques do you use to psych yourself up to find 10, 20, 30, 40 year old product remotely interesting?

DIB

”NIH":  http://www.businessdictionary.com/definition/not-invented-here.html

DIB,

Do you have a fear of competition?  Companies like Dyson will have to continue to innovate to be successful with their premium pricing.   American statesman and inventor Ben Franklin actually opposed patent protections because he thought it stymied innovation.   While Dyson has been innovative with the dirt collection system, his brush rolls leave a lot to be desired.  A Kirby vacuum with 1920's technology will outclean a Dyson on carpeting.  Apparently an Oreck vacuum with a clean bag will outclean a Dyson on carpeting too. 

Using your definition of steal, Dyson is guilty of theft too.  Dyson uses a rotating brush roll and nozzle which were invented long ago by others.   Dyson took a basic vacuum design invented by others and improved the dirt collection system.  That's it.  And that's the same thing that the others have done.  They use the latest technology available and try to  make some improvements.    While you may not like the dual cyclone copies, they have brought the technology to consumers who can't afford a $400 vacuum. 


DysonInventsBig wrote:

Hello DIB:

What do I admire about the tried and true vacuum companies in the industry that have passed the test of time?  Good question.  Simple answer, my good friend.  Let's start with this FACT:  They became and stayed successful without using gimmicks and false claims to promote/sell their products. 

And then add: I admire them too because they are the seasoned veterans of the industry.  The cornerstone and foundation of the very industry in which your fave brand is just getting started. 

And last but not least: Many of these companies, like TTI Floorcare of Glenwillow, Ohio, offer bagged and/or bagless brands and models in canisters, uprights, hand vacuums and sticks.  Why?  They understand very well that the majority [90 percent to be exact] of USA vacuum customers have a reportoire of household vacuum brands and products.  Not just one brand.  So these companies treat their rivals, some of which are related business wise, with the respect and dignity that they earned and deserve.   

Carmine D.

Severus wrote:
Severus,

When VAX took and fought for the right to use the Dyson creation, the Dyson phrase... “No Loss of Suction” am I being anti-competition?  I’m sure if Red thought they could get away with it they would lay claim to “Early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy, and wise.”  Trust me when Red creates something in-house they will fight for it and spend any amount of money doing so.

Ben Franklin (a gift to man) was courageous and correct about much.  Ben’s 2 primary innovations (that I am aware of) that he did not want to patent or hold back from being adopted quickly were - 1)  the lighting rod and 2) the cast iron stove.  And IMO, he was right and righteous in doing so.  But to apply Ben’s “ways” today would not be applicable nor necessary, unless the cure for cancer was invented or likewise.

Dyson has reversed engineered no one.  Dyson looks to and trusts in his and his peoples creativity first and uses expired patents second.

The majority of the science that goes into making a good vacuum is indeed very old.  Dyson has a business model and beliefs that are obviously different from some vacuum science.  He rose from obscurity overnight and became a billionaire from it, so who am I to argue with that (unless he asks)?

DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

DIB:

I'll argue with it because it's nonsense.  The FACT is dyson floundered from 1979 until 1992.  He got nowhere with his bagless vacuum.  Success came after he won two huge financial settlements for almost $8 MILLION at strategic times in his business career. 

The first in 1992, enabled him to set up the factory in Malmesbury, UK and produce 2 dyson bagless vacuums in 1993: Upright and cylinder models.  And still he had problems. 

The second settlement in the early 2000's, enabled dyson to expand and relocate to the Malay plant [Southeast Asia with a majority of Moslems] and go global by opening new markets.  Nothing to do with a business plan and model.  

And finally the FACT is that BEST BUY management convinced dyson to launch vacuums in the USA in 2002, after the Malay plant was operational, not his business plan.  James wanted to wait. 

Tell us:  What does the dyson business model say about selling $500 plus vacuums in a bad global economy?  Maybe TTI Floorcare can provide a copy of theirs to James to follow?  Only if he asks nicely.

Carmine D. 

CarmineD wrote:
Carmine,

Would it kill you or put you out to do a fact check and get your beliefs in line with historical facts.  Your “dumb luck” business model you try to color Sir James Dyson in is as you say is [pure] nonsense.  Please demonstrate for us how easy it is to collect millions from corporations via this dumb luck business model.  And surely there is a dumb luck business school you could recommend to anyone without the sense to provide for themselves.

DIB

Hello DIB:

You call it whatever you will: Dumb luck, lady luck, blind luck, fool's luck, beginner's luck, whatever.  I prefer to call these FACTS the untold story.  Or the story within the story.  Why?  They are not mentioned.  Probably because they were never part of the business plan/model. 

I can say with absolute certainty that TTI Floorcare of Glenwillow OHIO will weather the stormy days ahead and fare very well business wise.  It has all the right stuff to do well in good/bad economic times.   

Carmine D.

Carmine,

I have been wanting a Lexus, BMW, Porsche, GT500 or one of many exotic cars.  I will make a trip to the dealer.  If they refuse to cut the price in half I will explain your philosophy that times are hard and they will likely go out business if they do not sell on my terms.

No different than vacuums I suppose.

CarmineD wrote:
Carmine,

“The untold story?”  ....as told by the supermarket rags?  Come on, the guy invented widgets that huge companies wanted but did not want to compensate for.   Dyson did not roll over as they thought and instead fought (paid for a lawsuit which in reality he could barely afford) for is property, they eventually compensated [Dyson] in the form of a volunteered settlement (aka a big fat check).  Dyson reinvested his compensation in his future...  Dyson LTD.

I have no doubt Red will become huge and with monopolistic like powers.

DIB

Hello DIB/HARDSELL:

Sorry DIB but no dealer in his/her right mind will gift you one of those brands.  Why?  Tell me HS, my good friend, would you, if gifted a dealer BMW, Porsche, Lexus, GT500 then sell it after 2 years just to buy a brand new Ford Fusion?  Not withstanding that money matters may necessitate it!  Do you understand now why the dyson campers are upset with you!  And you posted it here too!  

Dyson will most likely survive, with luck.  More probable as a niche seller.  TTI Floorcare in the USA and HOOVER Candy Group in the UK  will dominate the market for the common folk in hard times.   MIELE, SEBO,  RICCAR/SIMPLICITY and the classic rebuilts will rule for the high end quality minded buyers regardless of the times. 

The question that looms in the darkness of the uncertainty ahead:  Will your fave designer/inventor and so called overnight successful business man make the Forbes list?  Check the business model and see what the contingency plan says.

Carmine D.