Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I've got an old snowblower that will not start even though we emtied all old gas from it , checked the spark-plug- ignition! and the new gas entered the carburettor but obviously not the cylinder why it didn't start. The snow blower is old but not much used 3-4 winters and for two years ago there was no problem whatsoever.

It is an ARIENS ST 504 motornumber HS 50670080 and serialnumber 93338.

We got a tip to change the diaphragm but does anyone know anything else we can do. The snow is coming in Sweden and I don't like showelling.

>>I've tried many over the years and have finally come to the conclusion that they're snake oil.   

   Me also.  Unless I see something concrete I’ll stick with the same view.

>>I did a few with various carb cleaners and got the same "no effect" results. 

   I did more myself with Seafoam and Stable and got no where.   I even did the dump into the throat thing a few more times with catches for anything that might have been loosened and blown out of the exhaust.  Nothing but impressive amounts of white smoke. 

 I’m dumping gas from machines all the time and put it on a shelf in the garage in large top containers.  You can see the water accumulation over time.  I never did that with pre EPA gas so unsure just what the difference in accumulation is.  It would be interesting to know just how much water would accumulate in old gas over new in 1 gallon over time.  I doubt if it would be much of a difference or make much of a difference. 

>>The misinformation we've been reading/hearing about the perils of E10 fuel is pure b.s.  

   Right, no consideration for extent or amount.  Water happened with the old fuel and with the new. 

>>I leave E10 gasoline in five gallon gas containers for five to seven months at my camp over winter with no additives. 

   Same here at the camp. 

    I guess anyone reading this could get a flashlight and look into their blower gas tank and refill tank that has been sitting for a while and look for any blobs at the bottom.   Don’t shake the tank before looking. If the tank is tilted like on many snowblowers the blob will be at the lowest level.  They are tough to see.  If none found note how clear the gas is and shake the tank.  If there is any significant blob you missed the gas will cloud.

That could be tested by putting gas, water and stable in a cup for a few days.  The water will blob at the bottom allowing the gas and stable to be drawn off.  You could then see if water ignites with a match.  I doubt it would.

When I get a machine I bring it out to the street, flip it up and degrease the body, internals and engine.  I used Gumout a lot over the years and got a can for cleaning the blower.  It barely did anything.  Quite a change and I have not bought a can since. 

I don't find carb spray to have much effect on most varnish but there are several types I've found and it works a bit on some.  I felt forced to use dips.  After reading a bunch many said the dips also are not like the old dips.  I now double dip with NAPA and Berrymans.  I use the spray for whatever cleaning it might do and to be a jet of something substantial to push stuck crud out from lodged places.   I also find I have to brush with carb spray.  I dip bowls occasioally to see how good the dip is working.  Some varnish it will make very soft but not disolve it requiring brushing or spraying to get it off the metal.

Yea I have to admint that 3 months does seem a little short  term but then again, I didn't write it I only forwarded it.

First hand I can tell you about one a young gentlemen who recieved a nice whopping $1,500.00 bill because he left the fuel (without additives) in his boat for 6 months.

The injector damage was primarilly due to the fact that he has a 30 micron filter in the engine that was not able to trap the contaminants but the real culprit here was the fuel.

I have very much the same setup in my boat only I have 10 micron filters in mine and I also used a fuel additive as directed by the engine manufacturer.

His injectors are clogged and needed to be commercially cleaned and tested. As for me, I went fishing.

I  figure it is generally good practice on my yard equipment to use the same maintinance ideology as if  it were an automobile (or boat)

Small engines generally don't even have a fuel filter which makes them even more vulnerable to contaminination. (now there's an industry cheepo for yah right up front)

You can take it for what it's worth but that is just one example of many and I am definately sold on fuel additives.

Not so much the stuff you can buy off the PeP Boy clearance shelf but I have found a few good ones like StaBil and I have been using them now for quite a few years.

It' seems a small price to pay for the problems that seem to be very common with E-10 fuels in boats, cars, and small engines.

Starwarrior

I've read that even Stable will turn to gum or varnish. 

   Conditions are generally left out of many discussions about fuel problems.  For example, I serviced a friends machine which was stored in a shead in the back corner of his yard.  The shed was under a tree.  The outside of the shed had a lot of green growth on it so damp.  There was some growth on the wood floors inside the shed.  The machine was about 10 years old and had rust all over.  The machine at best only had a couple of seasons left before it would fall apart. 

  The skids were worn off and the bucket sides being chewed off but it started on the first pull.  It was a surprise as I assumed it never had any maintenance.  I asked the guy about that.  He said he put the machine away after each use but did not clean it off.  He said he changed oil once a few years ago but never did anything with the gas.  Gas was left in year round, no shutoff, no draining of the tank or bowl and no stablizers.  First pull starts and never a problem with gas.  Lucky storage conditions. 

   It would be a different story if his shed was at the edge of the yard in the open sun where it could heat up and the temps get quite high.  Just say he left a log of gas in the tank and no fuel shutoff.  The gas in the carb would drain and more come down repeating over and over until gone.  That engine probably would not come close to starting in one season.  For another situation it might take several seasons before enough varnish started plugging things up.

   When I pick up dead machine I always ask about storage and what they did about gas and maintenance.  There's a lot of commen elements in the stories.

   Possibly the boat story was helped along by being at a dock in the sun all day.  Maybe it was covered and baked the fuel.  ?? Who knows.  There are lots of variations with conditions.  From what I've seen it looks like having a fuel shutoff helps out.  With a shutoff only a small amount will evaporate, at lest in the carb.

Carlb, thanks.  I'll keep an eye out for that.  I've tried all the cleaners in the stores around here and have not found any good at all varnishes.

FROM TECUMSEH MANUAL

 Fuel Recommendations

Today’s fuels have a short shelf life and it is recommended you buy no more than a two week supply at a time.

SHORT TERM STORAGE

TecumsehPower recommends using ULTRA-FRESH or Fuel Saver Plus Gasoline Stabilizer plus Fuel System Cleaner as an acceptable method of minimizing formation of fuel gum deposits during storage. This product is available from your Authorized TecumsehPower Servicing Dealer.

Always follow mix ratio found on stabilizer container. Failure to do so may result in equipment damage.

It is not necessary to drain stabilized gas from carburetor.

FUEL TREATMENT

1. Add fuel stabilizer according to manufacturer’s instructions.

2. Run engine at least 10 minutes after adding stabilizer to allow it to reach carburetor.

3. Instead of using a fuel preservative/stabilizer, you can empty the fuel tank as described under "Extended Storage”.

 FROM MY JOHN DEERE RIDING MOWER MANUAL

 Storing Engine:  Use TY6295 John Deere Gasoline Storage Stabilizer or equivalent in fuel tank.  Follow directions on can. Gasoline storage stabilizer must be used when storing riding mower to prevent carburetor varnishing and partial plugging of carburetor jets. Either of these conditions could cause the engine to run lean and result in piston seizure and engine failure.