Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

Hi guys,

Called Briggs with the spec # on the Simplicity I am looking at . The guy was very nice!! Called me back and spent a lot of time  but couldn't find the exact # I gave him. He said he was 90% sure the spec# I gave him  is an aluminum bore engine. What he was able to give me was the Phone # for Simplicity which I couldn't get on Friday. For you Simplicity fans the #is (262)284-8669.Hit 2 on your phone after you get through to get to the tech dept. Real interesting conversation with that gentleman.

1)All the engines in the large frame line are the same except for the 13hp unit."If you buy the the 9560E,1060DLXE,1170Eor 1280E you get the same engine."

When I asked him why he said it's more cost effective to power everything with the 12hp engine than to buy different engines for each model. He was very specific about saying the engine is the 12. The stickers are different.

2)" All the engines are aluminum bore models because they are the same engine" Simplicity chose to go with aluminum bore because they run cooler and in an environment absent of dust and dirt the cast iron isn't necessary.Today"s Aluminum alloys wear very well under winter conditions according to their tests."

3)"I should consider using the Briggs synthetic oil because it doubles  the life of the warranty. There is a chemical dye in the oil that colors the internal parts of the engine. If you have a failure they check for the color and you get a replacement." Sounds like a good deal to me.

4)He suggested using Simplicity part #1704636 to lubricate the gearbox. Infomed me that it is really a Snapper lubricant and that when Simplicity bought Snapper they found it worked very well. Said it doesen't thicken in the cold as much as other gear oils.

I pressed him a little on the aluminum bore issue reminding him that Simplicity used cast iron bore Tecumsehs before Briggs bought the company. He said that the purchase by Briggs had nothing to do with it.Simplicity started using Briggs three years ago when the Snow Intek first came out. He reminded me this was before Simplicity was bought by Briggs.When I asked him why the change he said there were too many issues with the Tecumseh carburetors .

 I went to the Briggs web site and spent some time looking at their replacement engine spec. book. Sure enough there are 9,10 and 11 hp. engines of the same displacement. To further confuse/enlighten me they listed engines of the same horse power that have different displacements.And to further confuse the issue Briggs does not list a 12 hp engine. 

I have a headache,

Marc

Marc, I didn't mean to get you testy by asking, I asked that way for a reason.

When I read the statement in quotes from the Sims rep.........

1)All the engines in the large frame line are the same except for the 13hp unit."If you buy the the 9560E,1060DLXE,1170Eor 1280E you get the same engine."

.......I read where he says the engines are the same. What I don't see is where he says they produce the same HP and torque and are no different in any way.

I was wondering if he was using the term "engine" as meaning the same block or, whatever. Like if I spoke with a service rep at a GM dealer and he said the Roadmaster uses the Corvette engine. He would be right, it does but, that's not the whole story.

Anyhow, that's why I asked, wasn't questioning your post, just looking for clarity.

Marshall -

Not testy at all!! Believe me !!! I am not at all angry and in no way mind being questioned.

The tech clearly stated that they were exactly the same engine except for badging.

For me this has been a wonderfull LEARNING experience. I now know to look at OPE the way the manufacturers do. The power is just an outsourced part to them.They don't even warranty it. No emotional involvement in the engine dept. as far as they are concerned. You could really tell that during the conversation. When I asked about the Power Boost which is a pulley and spring system unique to Simplicity the guy became totally enthusiastic! Talk about engines he could care less.

Marc 

This certainly has the title of the longest thread on Abby's.

I'm certainly still trying to find out more info.  Not getting many answers - but what do I expect sometimes???

And yes Marshall, it is a very longgggggggggggg thread - but well worth it.  I had the boss read it when it was in it's 60's and it took him forever.  Now that's it's longer - he'll have to take my word for it.

Sherri

Unfortunately I am getting no where with this.  Here is my response from Simplicity:

The horse power of the 1060E snowthrower is 10 HP.  The torque curve is
available from Briggs & Stratton.  They can be contacted at
800-274-4485.
The Model of the engine in the 1060E (1694590) is 20G414  0111-E1.
Thank you for your interest.
T. C. Sumner, Sr.
Service Department

Marc,
When you say spring and pulley system. If I remember it transfers "power" to the auger/impeller in heavy snow. I'm guessing it slows the units forward speed. So it has Reeves pulleys, like an MTD tractor with a Transamatic transmission?

MissSnowshoveler wrote:
Oh I agree, excellent thread! It just hit me when right before I made that post about the length of the thread, how many post there were. I was shocked.

Hi Guys

Mints-Under heavy load the machine"senses" the extra load and brings the split pulley that takes up the slack in the auger belt (idler pulley?) closer to the center of rotation of the engine shaft. This gives the auger more oomph because the idler is creating more tension on the belt. This is how the tech explained it to me.

 If you remember I bought this machine for my son so I haven't had a chance to play with it yet or look under the belt cover. I ordered the blow up diagram/parts manual which hasn't been delivered yet . If the diagram explains how it works I'll have my son post it.

What's a Reeves pulley and how does a  Transamatic transmission work?

Marc  

 

Hey Tom!

You might want to Email Mr Sumner and ask him why your neighbors 1280E(1694592) 12hp has the same 20G4140111-E1that your 1060E has. If yours is 10hp how can his be 12hp?

In poker I think they call that "call and raise"!  You might also want to inquire of him why Briggs doesen't list a 20G414 in their catalog of replacement engines in a 12HP model.

Marc

mml4 wrote:
I don't think the "more tension" explanation makes sense since that would mean that most of the time the belt is slipping. I don't know how it does it but my understanding is that the sysem changes the pulley ratio so that the auger /impeller have more torque when its under heavy load.

A Reeves pulley setup is where you have two variable diameter pulleys. As one pulley's diameter gets smaller the other one gets larger. This means that the belt tension stays constant but the ratio of the two pulley's diameters changes  and hence the speed and torque change. How the diameters change can either be automatic depending on the RPM the system is running at or it can be manually controlled. Normally you have one side of the pulley fixed and the other side is movable. As the movable side moves away from the fixed side the "V" shape of the sides causes the diameter that the belt is in contact with to decrease. As the sides move together the diameter increases. I remember reading about an automatic transmission for a car that was based on this system. An example of a manually controlled Reeves sytem is the Shopsmith, it has a dial that allows you to change the speed that the arbour is turning at. I've also seen it used in at least one wood turning turning lathe.