Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Today I fortuitously stopped at the local Oreck dealer. 

Mike, the owner of several Oreck franchises and a few multi-brand stores had brought his new Edge upright from home, as stock had not arrived yet.

It has a more powerful motor, with a true  floating head. LED lights, infinite speed control AND and on-board stretch hose with a permanently attached telescopic crevice tool that is automatically active when the handle is in the upright position.  It lacks the Pilot's pivot head and the Halo's germ killing light. A model incorporating all three features is under development.  It is still easy to push, although it weighs 10 lb and requires a bit more effort than previous models.

There is a commercial OBT upright made by Stein (Sebo) that is very nice at only 450.00.  Oreck WILL be offering a bagless upright, but dealer participation is optional.  The new canister is color matched to the Edge and designed to be leaned on as the user vacuums stairs. Odd looking bare floor/crevice tool, no swivel neck. The bristles fold in to form the crevice tool, and the wand is inserted into a neck that curves more than 60 and less than 90 degrees, much like the OLD bare floor tools made of wood with the metal neck screwed on. A turbo tool is included and a dusting brush.

A cute little bagless canister is available for 49.99  Oreck has increased market share and has 89% brand recognition as a vacuum cleaner. They have become #1in  air purifier sales. (Mike did not say if that was dollar volume, or units or both.

The price of the Edge and matching canister will be about 750.00

Oreck is still marketing, still developing product, and still building a loyal customer base.

CarmineD wrote:
Enough of the ad nauseum about you.  Where is the info that consumers need to make a buying decision? 

HARDSELL wrote:

I'd prefer to talk about vacuums and your likes and dislikes in those regards. 

You are one consumer not plural.  What's good for you is not good for consumers and vice versa.   You are a perfect candidate for a new dyson and I have said so on several occasions asking what you liked in the new dyson line up.  You tend toward trendy and innovative designed products with high prices and middlin performance.  Dyson's strong points.  Definitely avoid the ORECK brand.  Too old and staunch for a fad status buyer like yourself.  Although I said I would carry and sell dysons to customers who absolutely insisted, you are exception.  I would, based on what I know from your posts here, refer you to a big box retailer.  When I had my store business I did that on some occasions.  Knowing what to sell and when to sell and who to sell, oftentimes has nothing to do with the products but the people.  Some people are just hard to sell.

I hope my honesty doesn't offend you.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

Now we are getting somewhere Carmine.  Appreciate your reply.  Gotta get out the ol Bently and make it over to Allen Jacksons party. 

Have a good night.

HARDSELL wrote:

Can't get anywhere unless you answer.

Carmine D.

WRT the Oreck OBT issue, remember that Oreck stores repair all makes and models. The gather tons of info from the people who walk through the door, from those getting a vac repaired, to those shopping for a new vac, to those just buying bags, whether for on Oreck or other brand.  Hardly any of the OBT uprights that come in still have the tools on board. The customers normally have no clue what happened to them, except that  they fell off. The customers DO like the wand/hose to grab debris out of reach of the upright head, but did not care for the inconvenience of the slinky type hose and the way it collapses when any resistance is applied with a tool.. The majority of the people surveyed, Oreck owners and non, have a small canister for their upholstery, draperies, and so on.

Oreck discarded the 'longer hose-more tools' idea for their lightweight uprights because they offer uprights with a full complement of tools, and suction high enough to deep clean upholstery. To incorporate that concept into the open fan design of the traditional lightweight Oreck uprights is not easily done, and would be superfluous. If you want an Oreck pair, buy it, you want commercial grade OBT upright, buy it, and then there's always the Kirby, but then it does not have OBT (that we have seen, anyway)  No one cleaner has it all. Even Consumer reports says so.

Trebor wrote:

Hi Trebor:

Excellent points.  The problem with some, not all vacuum consumers, is that they don't know what they want and why.  They usually end up with a vacuum product that they don't like and don't want.  They blame the seller, the product, and a variety of others with excuses as long as their list of brands that they buy and return.  They don't own up to the fact that they didn't do their part [like answer a few basic questions] to ensure they get what they wanted and need.  Some people are just hard to sell.  I have found in my own store business that these are usually individuals who can't make their own purchase decisions and need/want some one else to do it for them.  They may be lazy.  May be indecisive.  May be perfectionists.  Any number of personality quirks.  They usually prefer big box retail stores with liberal return policies.  But may buy from an indy and/or d-t-d with mixed/conflicted buyer's remorse feelings.  Unfortunately, not all vacuum companies are like ORECK and allow free home use for 30 days.  Which BTW also gives ORECK an advantage over others by having a good sense for what their rate of returns are and even why.

Carmine D.

Trebor wrote:

Especially true when used in a commercial use/environment with multiple users.  Tools are the first to be scattered away and lost even with tool holders and caddies. 

Carmine D.

To repeat Carmine's quotes of me:

No one cleaner has it all. Even Consumer reports says so.

Most of the OBT up[right that come in no longer have the tools attached. The customers typically have no clue what happened to them except that they fell off at some point.

This is precisely why my friend in the vac shop responds with 'pick two' when someone wants a vacuum that deep cleans carpet, is lightweight, and has good on board tools. The closest yet is the Miele S7, the lowest priced model is 449.00 with a really good trade. If the slinky hose is troublesome, at 550.00  he can toss in an extension hose. Astonishing how many people come in 6 months later dragging a BBB( big box bagless) behind them with their eyes down and a sheepish look. Some of them trade up on the spot, some have the bagless unclogged, new filters and belt installed. The whole machine is cleaned and running like new, so they figure "What the heck, I'll use it for awhile yet" Anywhere from three months  to a year later, here they come, back again. They usually make it a little bit longer since they now know (and believe) that there are FILTERS in the vacuum that need to be kept clean, and the brushroll needs attention. At this point most of the returnees refuse to spend another 59.00 or so, and buy, or go to Walmart again.  I asked him about those who leave, usually leaving their vacuum behind.

His reply?
"Some customers cannot be satisfied, they don't WANT to be satisfied. Their joy in life is to complain, Let them complain-to someone else.  If they buy the Miele, or the Sanitaire all they will ever see is the price, every time they use it. Maybe after 10 years of trouble- free use they MIGHT begin to see the wisdom of the purchase. I cannot afford to let them learn on my dime and tell everyone how expensive a vacuum I rammed down their throat. I have had a few come back after years of burning up BB vacuums and say "OK. I should have done this years ago. I'd be money ahead. It was less expensive then, and I would not have gone through all these vacuums." They buy with minimal quibbling about the price, and walk out still unhappy about the money they could have saved, but at least they are not unhappy with me."

While he is knowledgeable about vacuums, he is also very astute when it comes to reading people, and that is the secret to his success.

CarmineD wrote:

An astute consumer is a HARD SELL.  It is especially difficult for a pro that is FOS to sell to them.

Why would a pro refuse to sell one of the most popular brands with a supposedly low maintenance cost?  Instead he chose to sell brands that were higher maintenance costs and shorter life.  I hesitate to buy from a pro that is more concerned with high profit than selling better products.

I find it just as amusing that a pro had to have his wife recommend a better vac than his selection.

HARDSELL wrote:

Disagree.  An astute consumer is an easy sell.  They know what they want and need.  Tell the seller.  And the products that meet the needs are given as choices.  Decision made.  Simple.

It's called age and ailments and daily vacuuming due to a dogs that sheds yearly.  8 pounds is a lot easier to use than 20.  Facts and circumsyances change, so do the products needed to keep up with the needs.  See easy and simple when you know what you need and want.

Carmine D.