Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Tho a couple of months away, the VDTA is slotted for Vegas this year AND central vacuum systems, tho relatively new venue to the vacuum trade organization, are getting increased emphasis.

Carmine D.

I saw that myself - normally the German manuals are both in English and German.

Granted the new D series looks a little like Vorwerk's Tiger but only a little...




Or the Panasonic MCE 800 series:

vacmanuk wrote:

Hey vacmanuk,

You go! So glad you checked that out.  Though there's little similarity to the Vorwerk Tiger, the design makes me think of the Nilfisk 930 in a roundabout way.  My reason is for this is due to the airflow draw being channeled to originate above the bag.  I don't know if the involvement of gravity was meant to be a key part in dust handling but the set up does to some degree allow dust to fall and collect at the bottom of the bag and leave the top portion of the bag more freed up for allowing optimal airflow.  The Nilfisk 930's filtration medium are housed in the cleaner's lid

http://webparts.nilfisk-advance.com/pdf/Instruction%20for%20use%20GD%20930%20EU.pdf

In response to the poster making mention of the conically shaped hose this was traditionally a trait of American made Electroluxes and also Nilfisk for many years.  Smaller point of entry with larger point of exit was to lessen possibility of clogging.

That said, the rest of this rather inttricately designed Sebo is quite interesting.  The manual shows how the airbelt is set up and how it muffles sound and subdues the motor exhaust.  I also think the "hospital" filter in teh bottom of the machine posibbly doubles its filtering ability by the way it has to be folded over on itself for installation.

For those not familiar with Verwerk vacuums, this is what Vorwerk Tiger canister I made mention of  looks like now.

Best,

Venson

There are a few people I know who own Vorwerk vacs in the UK but they are very rare and the stick / upright version is more popular here. Of those nearest to me who have sampled my Sebo uprights, they usually buy Sebo in the end because bags are cheaper and the machines are better thought out. Mind you I do like some of the looks of current Vorwerk models.

A large local vac chain here in Oregon that carries Sebo told me they may not carry the D series because "today there are too many high end canisters in the marketplace". 
However, the C series was/is looking dated compared to the current and upgraded Mieles.  Also glad to hear Sebo's finally offering a filtrette style bag in a canister.

At least Sebo did not make the mistake Miele did with the S5 series and put a filtrette bag in an undersized dust chamber, resulting in dust leakage and clogging of the HEPA filter.
That's never been a problem with the older Blue Moon I use.

vacomatic wrote:

Vacomatic:

You posted under the VDTA thread.  Did you attend?

Are you saying any oversized filtrette [paper byt cloth like] not just MIELE, causes dust to leak out into the bag compartment and pre-post motor filters?  Or something else?

Carmine D.

vacomatic wrote:

The S5s?  I don't whom it was that told you that but the high filtration bags I've been using in my S5980 Capricorn have not ever leaked. My cleaner is moving on toward two years of age and the biggest part of my worries about bags is paying for them.

In any event, the bag chamber is clean as a whistle.  That's the first thing I look for with any vacuum I use because a clean bag chamber is a sure indicator that a very  good part of what you pick up is and will be captured. Thus, I don't havew to give a thought to whether significant quantities of dust or dirt are gathering on motor componsnts.  The pre-filter and HEPA are clean too.  My S5 series machine is probably the only bagged cannister that I've owned that compares to Filter Queen -- my personal benchmark -- for best in show dust retention.

Miele had the foresight to place a fill-tube that fits into the bag collar and eliminates the blowback issue found in the less expensive but good Kenmore I might well have bought..  Kenmore yet insists on depending on the pressure seal between the lid and the bag holder to defeat leakage at the bag collar and it doesn't work well as it could.   Though not a major issue, one would think that someone would have started thinking about the matter as soon as they'd thought about upping their prices.

The Kenmore problem is best dealt with by not letting disposable bags get beyond the three-fourths full point.  On the other hand the generously sized bag in my Capricorn keeps me going.  Its inner layers contain dirt well but still allow good airflow until the bag is full.

Venson

vacomatic wrote:
Well as you say the C series was/is looking dated. If they sell the C series high enough i.e. if they get enough sales or have done already, then the D is the natural replacement and they may well have to sell it by demand as the C series will stop production sooner or later. I've never bothered with the C series on the grounds that my Miele S571 has already taken that spot of being a larger cylinder vacuum cleaner even though it uses the smaller F/J/M bags and I have never come across the dust leaking situation on general S500 models. Also the S571 is 1 kg lighter than the C series which is why I've never been taken with it. I do like the fact that the C series used the same bag as the X series and it is a pity that the D series uses an independently designed bag just for the model. It remains to be seen if the D series bags will be used for future models such as an upright vacuum cleaner. Sebo say that they have no intentions to update the current line up, but one never knows with the company - they play very strongly to their heart when it comes to model launches.

As for the S5's problem - i.e.e S5000 range which uses the larger dust bag - this is not a problem that I have heard about  - in theory it is possible that consumers have been confused by using the bigger G series bags in the smaller S500 dust bin and that could by design push dirt out.

I will venture to say the bag leak is user error. However I will say it's not totally unreasonable to have user error with the new bags. Since the new bags have come with that hinged cap they POP out of the holder on some models whenever the Compartment Lid is opened. Sometimes SO slightly that the user will not notice. When the user closes the lid, the collar on the lid does not slide into the bag opening correctly and may even creese it, allowing air flow to circumvent the bag. This results in a dirty compartment. NOTE: Always reseat the bag into its holder after opening the lid.

SEBO have now put on English to describe their latest D series cylinder vacs.


For the D4 for example:

"...The SEBO AIRBELT D4 is equipped with a lot of extras which make your life easier. A cleaning range of 15.5 meters provides more flexibility. The 6l filter bag carries more. The optimized air flow and the tapered hose give more suction. The variable suction control in the ergonomic handle offers more convenience. The new illuminated power display with LED performance indicators shows the suction power. It rotates slowly at the lowest level and faster at the highest level.

Of course the SEBO AIRBELT D4 includes all SEBO standards and quality „Made in Germany”: high class S-class filtration, patented SEBO AIRBELT, versatile turning swivel neck, variable telescopic tube, integrated bag change indicator, gentle soft-start system. The SEBO AIRBELT D4 is additionally equipped with the high quality stainless steel telescopic tube. The quality construction and the ergonomic design show that SEBO stresses optimum function and longevity. Therefore the SEBO AIRBELT D4 is extremely cost-effective in use.

The design of the SEBO AIRBELT D differs clearly from the other SEBO models. In collaboration with the designer Prof. Achim Heine a new striking shape has been created: it is purposeful, stylish and unique. Two fundamental geometric shapes, a circle and a square, are united. The design epitomises the classic way of engineering which looks for the optimum form for the function. It is contrary to most other models where form inhibits function. The designer Prof. Achim Heine teaches “Product design” at the University of Arts in Berlin.

15.5 m cleaning range– for more manoeuvrability
6 l filter bag – for more capacity, economic in use
Illuminated power display with LED performance indicators
High quality stainless steel telescopic tube
Optimized air flow and tapered hose – for more suction
Variable suction control in the ergonomic handle
Includes the innovative SEBO KOMBI
3 integrated attachments on board– for more cleaning options..."

Further reading from the manual shows Sebo installing a slow turn on the rotary dial on the main body for slow suction and faster turn for faster suction.

By looking at their online manual, it says the airflow for their highest end model is only 45 liters/second, which equates to 95.349 CFM per http://www.onlineconversion.com/flow_rate_volume.htm. Their C-series has 170 CFM! That's nearly TWICE the cleaning power, right?! This is kind of worrying me on the performance aspect here 0_o. Anyone care to chime in? Maybe the suction and airflow together on this new machine will equal or beat the C-series. That's certainly my hope and guess. Has anyone used these yet? If so, what do you think of the performance?