Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Dyson is in the news frequently and so a dedicated thread.

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CarmineD wrote:
Carmine, speaking of fairy tales, this is yet another example of you repeating your own lies over and over again, and eventually believing it.  Sort of like the statement about the U-bend on the DC07.  When I was at Wal-Mart last week to pick up another new machine (more on that later), I noticed the DC07 Original on the shelf right next to it.  I pulled the display model down, looked it over, and sure enough, the U-bend was exactly the same as all of the other DC07s I had seen in the past 6 years.  No changes whatsoever. 

Just like your claim about Dyson being forced to remove the "filters that don't clog" statement.  In the new DC25 brochure, "no clogging or loss of suction" is mentioned several times throughout.  You had mentioned the removal of this statement before the introduction of the DC24/25, and it's still there on a brand new model.  What happened?

-MH

mole wrote:
In you and Carmine's eyes, Dyson is always "soon to be" *something*.  Soon to disappear from the shelves, soon to be "scrubbed", etc.  But it never is.

I'd work on improving my "predictions" if I were you.  The track record on both of your posts isn't that great, to say the least.

Motorhead wrote:

Motor:

Here's the truth.  Within the first year of launch, dyson retooled the DC07 u-bend air way joint.  Making it permanent on the DC07-s and not removable.  It was removable originally on the first and early DC-07's supposedly to allow users to clear clogs/blockages.  It had a yellow thumb tab on it to depress to remove/attach.  People thought it was the handle release and would step on the thumb tab.  The piece came off and most stores' staff didn't know how to attach it.  It remained along side the dyson display model/still in the box never used.  Result:  No suction in the tool mode.  Fix:  Dyson knew a buck item was poised to derail its launch, and made the piece permanent.  Quick like. 

Good thing ORECK stayed the course and took dyson to court.  I have not seen the latest DC24/25 product lit.  But, if dyson is still using the false claim, then dyson is violating the NAD ruling and subject to punitive and monetary disciplinary actions.  Dyson isn't that stupid.  Even the dyson retailers have long dropped the use of the false dyson claim.  

Carmine D. 

Motorhead wrote:

Motor:

The writing for dyson is on the wall.  Look at the UK.  From 43 percent vacuum market share in 2004 to 28 percent in 2007.  Based on the facts, our prediction was accurate.  Dyson sales in Mr. D's country of original are off an average of 5 percent a year for 3 consecutive years steady. 

BTW, weren't you the one here who said dyson new vacuum sales in the USA were 4 MILLION units in 2007?  Was that a prediction?  It was wrong!  Certainly not a fact.  According to the dyson expert here, Matt mmc AirBlade, 2 Million dyson units [not counting returns and refunds] were sold in 2007.  You were wrong by a factor of 100 percent.  

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

Neither you nor mole predicted the Dyson sales to drop in the UK.  Once again you lie.  You said for three years that each new Dyson would put Dyson out of business and I said you were wrong.  I was correct.

You saind numerous times that BB was discontinueing Dyson and again I disagreed.  I was right again.  Your predictions are not so accurate.

CarmineD wrote:

First post here and I am curious.  I keep reading a couple posters saying that Dyson can no longer use this claim and yet :

 "no loss of suction"

and  statements like

"Dyson proves no loss of suction using the IEC 60312 Cl 2.9 test standard on uprights and canister
vacuums and using a test method based on the IEC 60312 Cl 2.9 standard for the handheld.

Dyson proves no loss of suction, best average pick up, and 'overall outcleans other vacuums' using results from
IEC 60312 Cl 2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 2.8, 2.9, ASTM F608 and F558, and DTM 755— an independently conducted Dyson test."

Are plastered all over thier webpage.  Are some here not understanding a ruling correctly, just blowing smoke to make an argument, or is Dyson in violation of a court order?

Hello JackD and welcome aboard:

Here's a synopsis based on my understanding.  I speak for myself and not a representative of any of the companies and customers directly involved in the matter. 

It's not a court ruling, but an NAD ruling.  NAD is a USA industry arbitrator who facilitates cases brought by customers and companies against businesses who make false, misleading, and deceptive advertising claims [read: untrue].

NAD and dyson.  The original dyson claim, also once used by retailers advertising dysons, WAS:  No clogging, therefore no loss of suction.  Dissatisfied dyson customers [read: with clogged dysons that lost suction] along with ORECK and HOOVER brought the dyson claim before the NAD.  Based on the evidence, NAD ruled that dyson could no longer say its vacuums didn't clog [read filters].  Dyson revised its claim to: Never losses suction.  Retailers stopped using the claim in print.

ORECK [possibly encouraged by other vacuum makers sitting on the sidelines monitoring the developments] decided to proceed against dyson with a legal action.  ORECK's right.  That's where it stands.  In court awaiting a hearing, trial and ruling. 

Hope that assists you in getting brought up to date.

Carmine D.

HARDSELL wrote:

HS:

What makes you think the USA is different than the UK?  I quote you this because it was an overused statement on many vacuum forums to convince consumers that the USA would fall for dyson the same way as the UK.  Contrarily, the reverse is true.  We can expect here what's already happend in the UK. 

Carmine D.

HARDSELL wrote:

HS:

Over the last few weeks, several posters here provided you with incontrovertible proof that all the major retailers are culling dyson vacuums from their shelves with discounted prices advertised much lower than dyson MAP.  MOLE and I predicted this would come to pass with the big box store venues and dysons.  It has.   One dyson supporter, Dusty, recently posted that he agrees with us as it concerns dyson and big box stores.   

Carmine D.

HARDSELL wrote:

HS:

Let's recap 6 years of dyson facts and circumstances in the USA and our predictions.  

The DC07 and DC14, supposedly the dyson signature models [you owned the DC07 but sold it], are being discontinued and sold on clearance by all the major retailers.  The DC07 as low as $289 this week.  Brand new.  From an MSRP of $439.  MOLE and I predicted this would happen.  

The DC11 canister for $499 was pulled off the USA markets after 9 months.  I was one of 2 of the biggest critics of its puny power nozzle as early as April 2004.  Right again.

The DC15 original Ball was launched for $699 in March 2005.  By September, dyson dropped the price to $599 starting with BEST BUY stores, as I predicted .  Currently, it is $499 and less. 

The DC16 cordless hand held has a 5 minute run time.  Disgraceful for a $150 vacuum product.  I was a huge critic of the product when HSN demoed it and one went dead on air in less than 2 minutes.  It is currently being discounted by dyson for $49 with any new dyson purchase.  Right once more.

One major USA rug maker voided its warranty if any of the dyson vacuums are used on its carpets. 

Consumer Reports consistently rates all the dysons, save the DC17, as fair to middlin at best in a field of many less expensive makes and models.  Even the DC17, with an original MSRP of $549, is discounted now for $499 [before other buyer incentives]. 

The DC16 Slim for $469 [supposedly dyson's best selling sku] is currently being sold for $369 and is being scrubbed by most big box retailers after just 2 years on the market. 

The DC24/25 are too new to have a past.  But the filtering is seriously degraded from the earlier dyson models.  Still researching and learning the reasons.  Tho MOLE posted the reasons in a post awhile back.  And we are slowly learning he's right.

The air watts and dirt bin capacities have been consistently down sized with subsequent dyson model.  Now the filter maintenance is also increased.  Making the user more burdened with performing frequent filter cleanings which degrade the life of the filters.  Prices are the same and/higher.

A sad commentary for dyson, its products and dyson fans who praise them.  The only glimmer of hope that dyson can point to here in the USA is the reliability rating it received from Consumers Report in March 2008.  It was second only to Kirby.   But this is the first time it was rated for reliability.  CR adds the caveat that the rating must be sustained to be meaningful.  Time will tell.

Carmine D.