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mml4


Snow is good,
Deep snow is better!


Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Points: 544

Conversation with Simplicity
Original Message   Feb 21, 2005 3:59 pm
Hi guys,

Called Briggs with the spec # on the Simplicity I am looking at . The guy was very nice!! Called me back and spent a lot of time  but couldn't find the exact # I gave him. He said he was 90% sure the spec# I gave him  is an aluminum bore engine. What he was able to give me was the Phone # for Simplicity which I couldn't get on Friday. For you Simplicity fans the #is (262)284-8669.Hit 2 on your phone after you get through to get to the tech dept. Real interesting conversation with that gentleman.

1)All the engines in the large frame line are the same except for the 13hp unit."If you buy the the 9560E,1060DLXE,1170Eor 1280E you get the same engine."

When I asked him why he said it's more cost effective to power everything with the 12hp engine than to buy different engines for each model. He was very specific about saying the engine is the 12. The stickers are different.

2)" All the engines are aluminum bore models because they are the same engine" Simplicity chose to go with aluminum bore because they run cooler and in an environment absent of dust and dirt the cast iron isn't necessary.Today"s Aluminum alloys wear very well under winter conditions according to their tests."

3)"I should consider using the Briggs synthetic oil because it doubles  the life of the warranty. There is a chemical dye in the oil that colors the internal parts of the engine. If you have a failure they check for the color and you get a replacement." Sounds like a good deal to me.

4)He suggested using Simplicity part #1704636 to lubricate the gearbox. Infomed me that it is really a Snapper lubricant and that when Simplicity bought Snapper they found it worked very well. Said it doesen't thicken in the cold as much as other gear oils.

I pressed him a little on the aluminum bore issue reminding him that Simplicity used cast iron bore Tecumsehs before Briggs bought the company. He said that the purchase by Briggs had nothing to do with it.Simplicity started using Briggs three years ago when the Snow Intek first came out. He reminded me this was before Simplicity was bought by Briggs.When I asked him why the change he said there were too many issues with the Tecumseh carburetors .

 I went to the Briggs web site and spent some time looking at their replacement engine spec. book. Sure enough there are 9,10 and 11 hp. engines of the same displacement. To further confuse/enlighten me they listed engines of the same horse power that have different displacements.And to further confuse the issue Briggs does not list a 12 hp engine. 

I have a headache,

Marc

This message was modified Mar 2, 2005 by mml4


SnapperV210P,Toro22177,TroyBilt42010Snowthrower,Craftsman Shredder,American Turbo Pressure Washer HondaGX200,Stihl011Saw,EchoPas260Trimmer Edger,EchoPB602Blower,EchoHCR150Hedge Clipper
Replies: 19 - 28 of 156Next page of topicsPreviousNextNext page of topicsAllView as Outline
Ben07


The more you know about something, the more you find there is to know.

Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Joined: Feb 26, 2004
Points: 178

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #19   Feb 22, 2005 1:29 pm
Yes Marc That does cloud the issue.  However now it don't for you as you know what the engine actually is.  And that's what they should be letting us know in the first place.

Ben07

Ariens 8524LE, Toro CCR2000, Jacobsen S-B S-blowers, Generac 10hp Gen-convt. to N.G., 5 L-boys(D's F's &Dura( 74,77,80,88,00), Antiq. 1960 AYP 20 in. mag w 3.5 Tech mower. Ryan/Ryobi gas Trim. AYP 205 gas blwr. Mac c-saw,Toro E-blwr, 2 Weed-E e. stg. trims. outboards, boats, util trail, 2 Jeeps 
Richie


Bring On The White Stuff

Location: Long Island, New York
Joined: Dec 12, 2003
Points: 562

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #20   Feb 22, 2005 2:21 pm
Ben07 wrote:

They never heard of one of their engines being 8.5 They said call the Blower manufacturer back.


Ben,

Exactly correct.  Just like my Toro comes with an 8 HP Tecumseh, which is a HP rating designated by Toro and NOT by Tecumseh.  Also why it always seemed to come up as a 9 HP. Good point and I'm glad you mentioned it.

Richie
Dantheman


Location: Orange County, N.Y.
Joined: Jan 21, 2003
Points: 561

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #21   Feb 22, 2005 4:21 pm
mml4 wrote:

 One of our guys on the forum,Dantheman, owns an11hp Simplicity 1170E for which he wrote a review . If the spec# on his machine is the same 20G414011E1 that would be confirmation of the engines all being the same. I am hoping he reads this post and can take a look.



Marc,

Indeed, it appears that I too have a 12HP Briggs Engine on my Simplicity. The Model is 20G414 and Type is 0111E1.

It sounds like people who bought the 9,10 and 11 HP Simplicitys with the Briggs Intek engine recieved a free upgrade!!!

Knowing this, it might be worthwhile for one to pay a couple of more bucks  for the Simplicity as compared to the Ariens being you're getting a top of the line 12HP engine instead if a 8,9,10 or 11 HP Tecumseh !!!

Before I bought, I also compared the weights of the Snowblowers and it seemed there was a decent jump in weight between the 10 and 11 that you did not see between the 11 and 12. Could it be slightly heavier components? 

My brochure from 2004 says  the 1170E (270) is 25lbs heavier than the 1060E (245). The 1280E (275) is only 5lbs heavier than the 1170E (270). 

Either way...I'm still very happy with my Simplicity ...used it Monday morning and worked great.

                                                                                           Dan

This message was modified Feb 22, 2005 by Dantheman
jubol


Location: Dover, De
Joined: Oct 3, 2003
Points: 1558

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #22   Feb 22, 2005 4:25 pm
 Dan,

 I think Tecumseh is doing the same thing,

8-11 HP engines all same displacemrnt, same weight, ETC!!

                                                                  Fred   

Husqvarna STE927(11.5HP) snowblower,  MTD Pro Series 18/42 Lawnmower, MTD 6.5 HP  Self Prop Lawn Mower,  Weedeater 1500 Blower, Web Gensis  2000 
mml4


Snow is good,
Deep snow is better!


Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Points: 544

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #23   Feb 22, 2005 4:28 pm
Hi Dan !

You are the man!

Thats the confirmation of the info from the Simplicity Tech guy.

Thanks ,

Marc

Dan ,I think the difference in the weight of the machines is the difference in the auger width and larger auger bucket.

These are the weights listed in my 2004 Simplicity catalog#040252,

9560E-230lb

1060DLXE-240lb

1170E-255lb

1280EE-265lb

I wonder what accounts for the difference in weights listed in your catalog and mine. I'll bet our catalogs are from different years. I just noticed the weights are listed as approximate.

Marc

This message was modified Feb 22, 2005 by mml4


SnapperV210P,Toro22177,TroyBilt42010Snowthrower,Craftsman Shredder,American Turbo Pressure Washer HondaGX200,Stihl011Saw,EchoPas260Trimmer Edger,EchoPB602Blower,EchoHCR150Hedge Clipper
Dantheman


Location: Orange County, N.Y.
Joined: Jan 21, 2003
Points: 561

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #24   Feb 22, 2005 5:09 pm
Marc,

I noticed this fall that Simplicity had lowered the weights on their snowblowers and your weights appear to be curent. 

My brochure is from August 2003 not 2004 as I had previously stated (sorry)

Perhaps the weights from 2003 are not accurate???

                                                                                                                    Dan

snowshoveler


tides in dirts out surfs up

Location: bridgewater nova scotia...aka the swamp
Joined: Jan 3, 2003
Points: 1261

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #25   Feb 22, 2005 5:12 pm
okay i had trouble beleiving this so i checked our in stock snapper snowblowers.

9 horse 10 horse ..exact same model and type numbers ...and now you say the 11 and 12 are the sameas the 9 and 10.

so are they all 12 horsepower.

the chassis on our snappers are all the same and the gear boxes are the same ,so the only difference from the 9 to the 11 is the width of the bucket.wow ,no wonder they work well.they certainly dont lack for power.

this justs keeps getting better all the time.

and briggs and tecumseh school is getting closer all the time,and i have some questions for the instructors-technical help.

later chris

craftsman 10/28 snowblower with tracks   husky 372xpg chainsaw   sachs dolmar bc212 bushsaw   mondo trimmer   monster tractor with trailer    cheep wheelbarro and couple shovels and a partridge in a pear tree 
Ben07


The more you know about something, the more you find there is to know.

Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Joined: Feb 26, 2004
Points: 178

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #26   Feb 22, 2005 7:23 pm
jubol wrote:
 Dan,

 I think Tecumseh is doing the same thing,

8-11 HP engines all same displacemrnt, same weight, ETC!!

                                                                  Fred   

Jubol I hope what you are chicking into is close to correct, as this was my description of my 8.5 before you made that post


"I know 10's and I know 8's and I know 5's in this type machine.  This thing was blowing at the strength of at least a 10 or 11 hp machine minimum." 

The reason being, I think I was very accurate with my observation,  but I am sure there are a few who if they don't follow it close will yea  "Yeah Right" 

Thxfor your help as I am unable to do research at this time

Ben07

P s If I find out it is an 11 I will softly freak.  I won't be too loud cause my kid will find out and steal it for a go-cart

This message was modified Feb 22, 2005 by Ben07


Ariens 8524LE, Toro CCR2000, Jacobsen S-B S-blowers, Generac 10hp Gen-convt. to N.G., 5 L-boys(D's F's &Dura( 74,77,80,88,00), Antiq. 1960 AYP 20 in. mag w 3.5 Tech mower. Ryan/Ryobi gas Trim. AYP 205 gas blwr. Mac c-saw,Toro E-blwr, 2 Weed-E e. stg. trims. outboards, boats, util trail, 2 Jeeps 
Richie


Bring On The White Stuff

Location: Long Island, New York
Joined: Dec 12, 2003
Points: 562

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #27   Feb 22, 2005 7:44 pm
snowshoveler wrote:
okay i had trouble beleiving this so i checked our in stock snapper snowblowers.

Two years ago I wanted to purchase a Simplicity.  The price of $1,400.00 I recall is what it cost.  I felt it was just too much money for an 8 or 9 HP machine.  Assuming this was going on back then, and given the fact these OPE manufacurers have been messing around for so long, and I have no reason to think otherwise, it answers the question why the price was so high.  This situation puts you on the other side of the street; you think you are getting say, a 9HP engine, but are really getting perhaps a 12 HP.  Bottom line is that nothing is free and one way or another you are paying a great deal of money for it.  Price a 12 HP Briggs engine with previsions for a lighting alternator and 110 volt electric start and you'll see what I mean.   It was still tough for me to walk away from the machine.  Once you grab the handle bars of a Simplicity, it just screams "tank"

Richie
TomP


Once you go Mac you never go back!


Location: Central New Jersey
Joined: Aug 4, 2003
Points: 648

Re: Conversation with Simplicity
Reply #28   Feb 22, 2005 7:48 pm
I am out of my league here but offer this as a potential explanation.

The Snow Commander R-tek is rated at 7 hp while the 3650 is rated at 6.5 hp.  The difference according to Toro is due to the piston (two additional ports) and cylinder.

My Simplicity 1060 has the 20G414 engine.  Looking at the parts catalog there appears to be 4 piston sizes (standard, .01" oversize, .02" oversize and .03" oversize.)  Could this explain the difference in horsepower generated using the same engine displacement?

Snow Team:

Simplicity 1060 DLXE - Toro Snow Commander / 3650 - Honda HS520
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