Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

Must be Valentines day,

Marc

Richie you are throwing a lot of correct applications in to the pot.  Lets just touch on them as one of em may just slightly get turned around.  The reason is your example is great  but even better if you turn it around and put it on the front of a car, a front wheel drive one where it does not have what is a term"a live axil plain" more commenly reffered to as a live axil.  In the FrontWD it has two independant Constant velocity joint axils.(two axils independently each side not housed therefore trued up with a CV joint.  There is no overall one piece casting connecting both axil's together., and the physics of these axils are pulling the car not pushing it which would further eliminates the aspect down to null. That is why the front example enhances your thoughts better as some will argue  that the rigidity of the system in the rear would nulify any type of independant suspension aspect. So just to leave a possable gray area out, I am gonna turn it around to the front where the slight axil twist of a conventional system don't come even close to coming into play. That's where you insight on independent suspension on the whole comes into play in a state of the art situation.  .   You know how this goes, you don't dot an eye and cross a tee, people pick on one slight gray area and try an make themselves an expert an you a fool,  even if you set up the whole thing as I did and specifically said I was taking all aspects of LDS out of my explanation. One because it is too complicated and 2 because they don't really work in production models.    And I got countered even when doing that,  by saying I was saying misconceptions and the misconceptions were trying to be countered by using the  Limited Slip Diff Applications (talk about seeing the punch coming ahead of time)   I don't mind I will go there, take a lot of key strokes,  getting countered there and someone saying, misconceptions is getting hit below the belt,  so ok let's discuss the falacy of Limited slip. So you are 100 percent right no axil twist there on front drive and the suspension further rules it out , however on Front wheel drive models they offer the option of traction control to try and help the so called automatic transfer from side to side.  Well why would they offer it if it worked in the first place, obvious answer is  It really don't work in the real world. And the small references I made to the burn being longer on the right side, is not responsable because of axil twist.  Your  example is a much better way of showing it rather than me saying there is axil twist but it don't come into play, and that the twist would actually cause the opposite and the left tire strip would actually be longer due to the less weight condition he reffered to in the first place.  Thanks for the further/better/sharper point Richie..       Back to your touching the break a lil when starting out on the snow.  That is a perfect example of probably one of the only applications where you can get a little amount of Limited slip to help you.  Reason being it is a slow start and the vehicle is not under load(remember torque sensative, had to reinforce that as I can see another punch coming here, so I will just pre type the answer and have it ready) , Same with the application of traction control, slow start vehicle not under load. LDS is torque range sensitive, that don't mean it has slow overall application to the process, it means it does completely different things at different speeds/ torques.  It is so full of not working more that working ,mechanics will not even try to understand them as the general consensus is they just don't work.  Thus the general consensus of if you have front wheel drive you actually only got one wheel pulling and on conventional 4x4 to be actually only two wheels pulling.

Very Thorough in your points R.  here is another example of the snow thingy.  I had an LSD car, that nomatter how perfect you kept the Emergency brake system and rear brakes, I mean in the condition of a well oiled shotgun,  In the slush and snow and freeze, it would  freeze up.  Consequently someone would use the car, tell them not to use the E-brake unless you have to.  What the car would do to them is they would be parked with all four wheels on snow, they would release the brake and try to move, the brakes would be hung , the right rear would break because the LDS put the power there.   However the left brake shoe would be hung up, so the person cannot move the car. Cause the right wheel and note only the right wheel., is spinning on slippery surface and the left one has the brake on, and the LSD will not transfer any power over there. (naturally they would say I took the emergency brake off and the car still won't go, kinda like some accusations here when the real issus is I told you not to put it on in the first place.)  So I would go get them or over the phone to just start the wheel spinning and slowly press on the brake and pop it would trans enough over to break the lock.

If it worked the way it was suppose to one would never have to do that

Ben,   I suspect  we still disagree somewhat on how differentials work but it's been a lively discussion anyway.      -Bob

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Ben,   I suspect  we still disagree somewhat on how differentials work but it's been a lively discussion anyway.      -Bob

Thx Bob I appreciate your comments.  I'd be willing to bet if we were talking in person over a couple of beers, we would be able to explain each others aspects much better,  and not disagree as much as it appears. ,, and learn more in the process.  Two heads are better than one etc. 

Hard to do some of that in the forum , typing on a computer, context, emphasis gets confusing etc. 

If you can ever help me out  feel free to step in. I'll do the same.

Regards Ben07   

I believe it came out that the person who looked at it said all four wheels turned, as they were directly hooked up to the drive line.  They said there was a trigger on each handle that lets use the example if you wanted to turn left you would activate the left trigger and it would in essence disconnect  the left two wheels from the system, and they would then be free wheeling.

I think it may be similar to what toro has, on their high end models, so you could research there.  IWill PM someone whom I think has that sys and see if he will post here as I wanted to ask him how it worked anyway

Ben 07