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70chevelless


Joined: Jan 29, 2010
Points: 14

Toro snow blower traction drive
Original Message   Jan 29, 2010 2:42 pm
 Afternoon,

  I have a 1979 Toro 524 model # 38040 ser. # 900163 my father bought new when he passed away it became mine. In 2001 the original engine blew so I put a 7.5 h.p. Briggs & Stratton Intek snow on her. One night this year I was doing the driveway & one of the original chains came off & got jammed in the auger after getting it out it started right back up. When I checked the tire was flat (also original tires) I could not get the wheels off they were so rusted on & when I put a tube in the tire it came out through the sides.

 So I bought a axle off ebay new wheels snow hog tires & bearings I had to cut the old axle in two and after a lot of work finally got it out. Put the new axle in her mounted the tires on the new wheels & put a ton of anti-sieze on the axle new bearing. Anyway I noticed that the rubber drive wheel was almost sitting on the front pully having the original owners manuel I read where the rubber drive wheel must be equal distance from the front pully & the rear friction disc. So I adjusted it per the manuel but when I put her in gear the rubber wheel did not even touch the front pully so I put it back to where it was.

 I just bought but have not put it on as of yet as winter has returned to where I live & our driveway is a hill more like a mountain. What I'm finding is she goes very slow in 1st it has 3 speed forward & 2 reverse as I said I did all the adjustments per the book. Today was the first time I used her since doing this work & find she goes very slow up the hill a lot slower than I remember I'm not sure if the new rubber drive wheel is going to do the trick as even with the old flat tire it was going faster than this. So my question is has anyone had this problem or can come up with an idea as to why she is going so slow?. 

 Also I was thinking since I can't remember if I ever changed the belt or belts if this could be the problem I might of gotten oil on it. Which leads me to another question how do I find out what size belts I need?. Reason I'm asking is I went from a 5h.p. engine to the 7.5 B&S Intek snow & I would think the shaft is higher on this?.

 Truth be told I should of left the old rubber drive wheel in the position it was in  I think but after 30 plus years I think that the rubber would be worn this is why I bought the new rubber wheel but have to take everything back out to get it on & right now I need her. This is why I would like to at the very least change the belts. Anyway if anyone can give me ideas as to what they think it could be please let me know?. Thank you very much for your time & help!.   

   

Replies: 1 - 10 of 10View as Outline
mml4


Snow is good,
Deep snow is better!


Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Points: 541

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #1   Jan 30, 2010 9:19 am
At first I thought the old  rubber friction wheel is so worn as to have decreased so much in diameter that  the drive ratio changed. However I think that would have given you more speed not less. I think the answer to your situation is to put the new rubber wheel on and adjust it according to the manual. 

If you adjust the position of the old wheel further out from the center of the friction disc you may pick up speed but you might lose one if not both of your reverse gears. As far as the belt length is concerned I think if the old belt cover still fits without interfering with the pulleys on the Briggs you may be able to get away with using the old belt lengths.

 Just a question - Are the auger rakes spinning free if you pull the shear pins? Given that you had such a difficult time with the wheels you might want to check that and grease the zerks while you are at it. 

Good Luck,

Marc

SnapperV210P,Toro22177,TroyBilt42010Snowthrower,Craftsman Shredder,American Turbo Pressure Washer HondaGX200,Stihl011Saw,EchoPas260Trimmer Edger,EchoPB602Blower,EchoHCR150Hedge Clipper
70chevelless


Joined: Jan 29, 2010
Points: 14

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #2   Jan 30, 2010 10:45 am
mml4 wrote:
At first I thought the old  rubber friction wheel is so worn as to have decreased so much in diameter that  the drive ratio changed. However I think that would have given you more speed not less. I think the answer to your situation is to put the new rubber wheel on and adjust it according to the manual. 

If you adjust the position of the old wheel further out from the center of the friction disc you may pick up speed but you might lose one if not both of your reverse gears. As far as the belt length is concerned I think if the old belt cover still fits without interfering with the pulleys on the Briggs you may be able to get away with using the old belt lengths.

 Just a question - Are the auger rakes spinning free if you pull the shear pins? Given that you had such a difficult time with the wheels you might want to check that and grease the zerks while you are at it. 

Good Luck,

Marc


 Morning Marc,

 Thank you for your help!. I tried adjusting the old wheel out further but it did not seem to do anything I'm going to bring her back in the garage latter as it is -20 outside & will try that again. What I can't understand is it has the same or seems to have the same speed as it always did in reverse but maybe this is only because I'm holding it with the lever so it's really gripping the rear friction disc.

 I want to check the belts that is the reason why I'm bringing her back in the garage from the barn I'll have to call the Toro place & see what the original belts are & if they have them in stock (he is always trying to sell me a new one! LOL) 

 Foregive me for asking this but what u said about the auger  what are the shear pins? & what is the Zerks?. I'm sorry I have heard of these things before but am not sure what they are.

 Once again THANK YOU for your time & help.

 Will,

hirschallan


If it aint broke don't fix it !!


Location: Northern Hills of NY
Joined: Aug 25, 2005
Points: 316

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #3   Jan 30, 2010 8:10 pm
He is saying that if you had so much rust on the wheel shafts you may also have rust between the the auger rakes and the shafts thereby not saving your gear case in the event you get a frozen news paper or the like in while snowblowing. Zerks are the grease fittings on the auger shafts next to the shear pins. The way you grease those shafts is to remove the shear pins and pump grease into shaft via the zerks until you see some coming out the ends and also turning the rakes on the shafts prior to reinstalling the shear pins thereby spreading the grease in between the two shafts. Hopefully you wont find them rusted like they are welded together.

70chevelless


Joined: Jan 29, 2010
Points: 14

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #4   Jan 30, 2010 9:20 pm
hirschallan wrote:
He is saying that if you had so much rust on the wheel shafts you may also have rust between the the auger rakes and the shafts thereby not saving your gear case in the event you get a frozen news paper or the like in while snowblowing. Zerks are the grease fittings on the auger shafts next to the shear pins. The way you grease those shafts is to remove the shear pins and pump grease into shaft via the zerks until you see some coming out the ends and also turning the rakes on the shafts prior to reinstalling the shear pins thereby spreading the grease in between the two shafts. Hopefully you wont find them rusted like they are welded together.



 Thank you for explaining this on this snow thrower the auger is a big drum I see the holes where the sheer pins must be although as paco said in the other post for some reason Toro does not call them sheer pins.

 I'm not even sure there are grease fitting as I have been looking at the diagram of this snow thrower but will check tomorrow. I think I understand what u are trying to tell me if I'm not mistaken they could have broke but are so rusted that they did not do what they were supose to do?.

 What I don't understand is the night this happen & after I got the chain un jammed she ran fine & I still had more than half the drive to do. The auger & impeller are turning fine except I think I have to change the belt but the forward gears were right up to speed.

 It was not until I did the work to her & adjusted it to specs. that it ran slow in forward not the auger but the speed of the forward gear. I'm not having trouble with the auger or it throwing snow.

 Having said that if it is true what u said about the sheer pins would this cause the machine to run slower in forward this I don't get? I'll order them bolts as that is what Toro calls them why they don't call them sheer pins I have no clue but I would think if they broke or if I did damage to the auger gear box due to the pins being rusted that the auger would not turn?.

 But please correct me if I'm wrong?. And also would this have something to do with the forward speed I mean she even moves slower in the garage under no load with the auger off.

 Thank you

 Will,  

hirschallan


If it aint broke don't fix it !!


Location: Northern Hills of NY
Joined: Aug 25, 2005
Points: 316

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #5   Jan 30, 2010 11:48 pm
70chevelless wrote:
  Having said that if it is true what u said about the sheer pins would this cause the machine to run slower in forward this I don't get? I'll order them bolts as that is what Toro calls them why they don't call them sheer pins I have no clue but I would think if they broke or if I did damage to the auger gear box due to the pins being rusted that the auger would not turn?.

 But please correct me if I'm wrong?. And also would this have something to do with the forward speed I mean she even moves slower in the garage under no load with the auger off.

 Thank you

 Will,  



The shear pins have nothing to do with your forward or reverse travel speeds but much to do about the the way your snowblower gets rid of the snow. If your auger rakes do not spin freely when you try to move it by hand (of course motor off and spark plug wire disconnected) then you either have your shear pins in or the auger shafts are rusted together. Also if you were to have a gear box problem you wouldn't be throwing snow. Your speed issue is a separate problem unrelated to shear pin issues.
This message was modified Jan 30, 2010 by hirschallan


mml4


Snow is good,
Deep snow is better!


Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Points: 541

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #6   Jan 31, 2010 6:20 am
Can you get the speed you want by using another gear? It may be that is all you have to do.If you adjusted the placement of the rubber drive wheel to the friction disc according to the manual and you have all the gears both forward and reverse there may be nothing wrong. 

Marc 

SnapperV210P,Toro22177,TroyBilt42010Snowthrower,Craftsman Shredder,American Turbo Pressure Washer HondaGX200,Stihl011Saw,EchoPas260Trimmer Edger,EchoPB602Blower,EchoHCR150Hedge Clipper
70chevelless


Joined: Jan 29, 2010
Points: 14

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #7   Jan 31, 2010 7:40 am
mml4 wrote:
Can you get the speed you want by using another gear? It may be that is all you have to do.If you adjusted the placement of the rubber drive wheel to the friction disc according to the manual and you have all the gears both forward and reverse there may be nothing wrong. 

Marc 



 Good Morning,

 When I tried to adjust the rubber drive wheel per the manual is when I had no forward gears 1-3rd. So then adjusted it back to where it was & I had all forward speeds again but am finding it to be going very slow in first. How I can tell this is two ways one our drive is very steep & the other day after working on her & also when I had the tube in the tire for the short time betwwen it eating up the chain & fixing her right she is hardly moving up the driveway. Also there is a ramp or step to the barn & she does not go up this at all in 1st where before she went right up it.

 So today I'm brining her out of the barn (to cold in there) and in the garage to look at her what I'm thinking is maybe my belt is worn or when she ate the chain it did something to the belt?. I know this is a long shot  & has nothing to do with why I can't adjust it to the specs. but  it's the only thing I can think of now.

 I will check the shear pins also but on the old Toros with the big drum there a bear to get to & have none to replace them with I guess I just can't understand why they did not break?.

 I have a new rubber drive wheel but do not trust the weather enough to put her in.

 One other consideration I did not mention before is I went from the original tires 13x4-6 to snow hogs 13x5-6 (what a pain that was mounting them on the new wheels last week) but could this be a factor?

 As I have said anything you can think of please let me know?. My closest Toro dealer is a half hour away & is always trying to sell me a new one! LOL there more than I paid for my car.

 Thank you again Marc!

   Will, 

hirschallan


If it aint broke don't fix it !!


Location: Northern Hills of NY
Joined: Aug 25, 2005
Points: 316

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #8   Jan 31, 2010 11:46 am
I think you need to see in what gear the manual tells you to make the adjustments.That will make all the difference in the other gears perhaps.Also you may have a belt slippage issue thats needs to looked at.

70chevelless


Joined: Jan 29, 2010
Points: 14

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #9   Feb 2, 2010 5:55 am
hirschallan wrote:
I think you need to see in what gear the manual tells you to make the adjustments.That will make all the difference in the other gears perhaps.Also you may have a belt slippage issue thats needs to looked at.



 Good Morning,

 The manual says to check it in 1st gear & that the short rod should be (if you are standing behind the machine) all the way left not the rod but the lever it's hooked to which would make the rubber drive wheel as close to the center of the rear pulley which would make it the slowest then 2nd & 3rd the wheel moves out on the pulley & faster.

 I think you might be right as I changed the belts yesterday & although I have not tried her yet the traction belt was streched I think when she ate the chain it did something to the belts. I guess I'll know more today all I want to do but I guess that is after she has been running for a while is change the auger gear box fluid i think the last time it was changed was ten years ago! but it's not a show car I sink way to much money in my rides & need to take better care of other things LOL.

 Thank you for your reply & will let you know what happens.

  Will,

slwryde


Joined: Feb 22, 2013
Points: 1

Re: Toro snow blower traction drive
Reply #10   Feb 22, 2013 9:41 am
I don't know if you ever found the problem with your snow blower. I have the same problem with mine.
No matter how I adjust it the unit will not go forward under its own power.  The problem with mine is a
worn out drive shaft spacer.  It allows the drive shaft (which has the front and rear drive hubs on it)  to move forward
and backward.  When it moves forward the friction disc does not reach it to drive the unit.  Revers works because when it
moves backwards it pushes against the rear drive disc.  The spacer is obsolete.  I just made one from plastic.
Works again!!
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